Interview for the Amiens Jazz Festival, April 2001.
Interview by Claude Carrière
Claude Carrière - Piano and freedom
On the proximity between the work of a classical pianist and a jazz player : do you think the jazz player is the freer of the two?
Manuel Rocheman : Yes, certainly. Much freer. Freedom stems from the jazz player not having a set script to keep to. In jazz there is a free choice of subject. A jazz standard is a bit like an essay subject. You are free to imagine the overall structure : introduction, first paragraph, second paragraph, third, and conclusion. You have to try to construct something in relation to the notes, the rhythm and harmony. It's fascinating. And that's what I like about it. A classical pianist has much more limited freedom. Even if geniuses like Gould or Michelangeli have stamped each of their interpretations with strokes of brilliance.
CC : Jacky Terrasson, one of the most listened to French jazz players, admitted a few weeks back that the world of classical piano was much too "middle-class" for him. Do you agree with that judgement?
MR : Middle-class? I don't know. I think relations among classical musicians are much more stilted. We are much more relaxed about things in jazz.
CC - On the trio.
Why such an attachment to the trio ?
MR : It's the formation that most appeals to me. That's where I feel best. The trio opens out to a wealth of exchanges. It's an opening on the world. I think, generally speaking, the trio remains the ideal format of expression for the piano. And perhaps I'm a little stubborn too. When I'm on something, I like to get to the bottom of things as far as I can. With piano-bass-drums you could spend two lifetimes ! It's not because I don't want to do other set-ups, but more through lack of time. I don't want to do three or four different things at once because I would feel I was only half doing them.
CC : In the trio, the choice of partners is obviously crucial !
MR : I expect them to accompany me, to bring me along and sometimes even get ahead of me, going where I want to go. To be on the same wavelength, of course, but without it necessarily being up to me to take the initiative. It's a dialogue on an equal footing where everyone's cards are on the table.
CC - On writing
Do you enjoy writing music ?
MR : I must admit to being frustrated by writing ; it's a discipline I don't practise regularly enough. I need a specific commission to buckle down to work. If I manage to get down twenty to thirty seconds of music a day I'm really glad. In writing this piano concerto, I try not to ask myself too many questions. I avoid listening too much to Bartök, Ravel or Dutilleux, or I get a mighty great slap in the face. I write at the piano not at the desk, by hand with a scale, I'm still not a whiz at computerised music. What I find most thrilling in composing is being on the verge of a vast world of sound. Because writing doesn't come easily to me, it's rather laborious, it burns me out. But once out, it's a terrific pleasure !
CC - On the standards
There are far more standards on Come Shine than on your previous albums. Is that a deliberate move ?
MR : I'm more at ease with standards than before. I enjoy this form, this formula, even if it is still very testing. Jazz for me is above all a music of freedom. I need a frame of reference, rules and constraints to best exercise and assert that freedom. A standard is only of interest insofar as you can renew it, shake it up, freshen it up. So I opted to play Come Rain or Come Shine. Now there's a very well written theme but not one that's easy to play because it moves a little in all directions, always upwards. It modulates a lot, setting off in F and arriving in F minor and B flat minor. I admit I do enjoy playing standards in different, unexpected ways.